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Sent: Sunday, February 05, 2006 8:16 AM
Subject: RE: RE: Summary from Meeting of 1-23-06

Yan,

Once again provocative thoughts...thank you.

I will probe only one of the many notions you highlight: Where is it appropriate to focus on "growth"?

The literature indicates we do NOT know what triggers growth to new levels. We DO know some conditions that must be present, but have NOT found the trigger we can pull and make growth happen. Would it not be more appropriate to focus on removing the threats to well being at each level, thus making space for healthy living at each level. It is likely that you, and I, and every other Joe and Suzie, will remain at our current center of gravity, with our usual outlying data points, for the foreseeable future. Thus attempting to engineer vertical growth would be a lot of unproductive effort, and thru it all we would be denying the value of our present configuration..

Also, are there not significant enuf contributions coming from healthy people centered at any level? Are we not eclipsing the blessings people are right now by focusing on where we will one day get to?

Personally, I think more is to be gained from accepting current levels of vertical unfolding. To affirm for someone that they are ok where they are, will more likely encourage horizontal growth, which is a refinement of expertise, an increase in effective living, a likely increase in the contribution to those around us.....AND as much an embodiment of Eros and Agape as any vertical emergence. If someone is centered in Red thinking, does not have his life or liberty threatened, and honestly confesses happiness, is that happiness of any less a success than the happiness of someone at, say Yellow? I think not.

And if we are to race up the Spiral to our "greatest destiny", when we arrive are we more valuable? better beings? more worthy of having a life? superior in any fundamental way? I suggest not. And to the extent I am correct, what is it then we are trying to grow to? I suggest, we have no where to get to. If we get there, we will find ourselves, again. And maybe something will be new, more, greater, whatever. But we will still be little two-leggeds, needing food, shelter, dealing with pain, loss, happiness, and one day we will die. What is this notion of "growing"? Perhaps we are nothing different than flowers: Seeds, to sprouts, to buds, to blooms, to seeds, to dust. And no stage is worth being sought after, for seeking, even if it accelerates movement thru stages, only gives a life of effort, acceleration, and death. I think, perhaps, a life of gratitude, centered in the Present, embracing the what is, devouring the gift of the moment the way it is, loving our current condition, and enjoying the changes, i.e. pursuing our happiness, is the achievement. Perhaps effecting vertical growth is really none of our business!

It would be valuable to look at what the underlying structure, or assumptions, of our thinking is that generates an imperative to grow vertically. But let me take the short cut. Let us remove all imperatives to grow vertically from our thinking. Now do we have a life that is any less than it was when we had that imperative? I suggest that it is more likely we have more of a life. For one minute, especially those of us whose ego has been calmed by evidence that we are second tier thinkers, imagine you are really a Blue thinker. You know the rules of Yellow thinking so well that you can talk Yellow....not cuz you are centered there, but cuz you know how it should sound. Can you recognize this Blue self as no less a blessing on the planet than the Yellow being your wish you were? And can you let go of the wishing? If we want liberty, life, and happiness, we best be free to love ourselves as we are, live our life as it is, and be open to what REALLY makes us happy.

I am sure there is something to be said here about the body of humanity, and the rightness and necessity of each being and its level, at every moment. I will leave that perspective to others to unfold.

Comments from all invited.

Tom C.

-----Original Message-----
From: On Behalf Of Yan Song
Sent: Saturday, February 04, 2006 8:01 PM
Subject: Re: RE: Summary from Meeting of 1-23-06

We are talking about consciousness here - it does move quite a bit even within a single individual through his/her own life time. Life conditions are indeed paramount but not the only factor. Internal complex bio-soci-psych codes or Memes is another. How else can we explain that people under similar life conditions make dramatically different choices and impacts in history? In Ken Wilber's model, both subject and object worlds must be honored at the same time to accomplish holistic growth. To reduce life conditions to memetic codes or vice versa would be quite reductive vs. integral indeed.

Best Regards,

Yan

----- Original Message -----
From: Tomc
Date: Friday, February 3, 2006 5:48 pm
Subject: RE: Summary from Meeting of 1-23-06

Yan Song,

Great contribution....thank you. More please!

One quick clarification. I don't think it is useful, or maybe even appropriate, to think of moving people around on the Spiral. People are who they are, and as Clare Graves has said, "People, goddamit, have a right to be who they are." The theory says that life conditions generate condition appropriate Memes. So if one wants to do a bit of social engineering, it would appear addressing changes in Life Conditions is the appropriate way to encourage Meme development. Our work on Monday will be to begin crafting a story that reaches all Memes. The intent is to find a way to speak, on one topic, to many levels of listening. A successful outcome of this project would be a huge, earth shattering, monumental increase in the number of people engaging in political activism. We are basically asking: How can we get more people engaged in the political process in the USA? Creating the marketing piece, the multi level story, has to be achieved, before we can address how
to keep this story alive. Keeping it alive is a tantalizing query...and could be the step to follow a success on our target project.

For anyone who did not get the summary of our last class, I have posted it on my new website: www.tomcintegral.com. See you all 2:30p Monday, Mem. Union. There is also the monthly Ken Wilber meetup.com gathering at 7p, Ground Zero Coffee House, Willy St., Monday. All are invited.

Tom C.

From: On Behalf Of Yan Song
Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 5:26 PM
Subject: Re: Summary from Meeting of 1-23-06

Hi Tom and integral thinkers

Thanks a lot for publishing the meeting summary, especially for the out of town folks like myself, this is extremely helpful and stimulating as well as giving us a chance to participate.

If I understood you correctly, you are trying to develop a story line that will speak to all "Memes" within a particular social group - to different degrees, of course - and therefore stimulate some growth along the spiral.

Don Beck did a recording with the What Is Enlightenment magazine that mix historical facts with music and might be considered as a story line for humanity as a whole. I assume that you are attempting to do one more specific, such as for Americans?

The challenge I see is that if you are too generic, it's hard for people to relate to and if you are too specific, it loses the transcendent value in proportion to whatever marker you use to identify a social group.

In my opinion, the real issue is not so much coming up with a common vision but how to realize and keep such vision alive and self-sustaining in ordinary lives - in families, workplaces, clubs, churches, etc.

It's a fact that ordinary people hardly if ever think vertically. People tend to socialize with friends just like themselves (same or similar memetic color). That gives them a clear identity which provides the psychological security and comfort that all human beings need. Unless faced with a crisis, external or internal, people tend to run away from anything that threatens their hard earned and always fragile equilibrium around a particular meme. In terms of spiral dynamics, we've got to knowledge the fact that time and space spent in between different levels are scary and unstable. How could we motivate people to make the efforts instead of seeking the "easy" way out?

In addition to the "American Soul", which is a great book and correlates intimately with my own experience of growing up in Communist China and coming to the West only to be nearly overwhelmed by consumerism, I would also recommend "The Art of Living Consciously" by Nathaniel Branden. Nathaniel does a great job of transcending everyday experiences into conscious living so that people can start at 1% or 5% level vs. having to take a leap of faith right away.

Sorry for mumbling along and hope that it makes some sense. Now I've got to go.

Best Regards,

Yan